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What to Do When Dealing with an Unconventional Elevate? (poker tactic)





Just one extra Hand of the Working day is coming from Reside at the Bike. I performed this money activity hand from David and I produced some faults.I definitely missed my possibility to win a greater pot, but this hand is fantastic for poker examination. What poker tactic would you use in this problem? Share your views in a remark down below.

Peace,
Alec

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38 comments

  1. Nice video. I would have played the hand the same way especially on the turn. You can what if yourself to death on value betting the river. After a hand that is repped (straight, set) that has you beat, you're now in the is it a value bet raise, or is it defensive. Out of postition, you played the hand great in my mind.Thanks again!

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  2. Very clear ship on the turn Alec

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  3. I definitely like flatting on the turn against an amateur especially when he already did something unconventional on the turn. Now checking the river is a NONO. I don't like jamming as amateur players will make a crying call with one pair top pair hands. Especially on the river. When he min raises, whether its a blocker, a straight J9, or a set (which is the LEAST likely in my head) its irrelevant to me as played. Now, on the river it's a clear bet. Yes, jamming gives you max value but how often will he call. Plus, this is one of my pet peeves in poker when player say Max value. I'll tell you what isn't Max value. Not getting paid at the end when you know he has a hand and you are pretty confident that you have a better hand. I like betting 55%-60% as I feel he will call this close to 100% of the time. Anything over 60% pot I feel that he would contemplate folding. He looked uncomfortable on the turn when he made his play, so I think betting river would make him even more uncomfortable at slightly over 1/2 pot. Jamming gives him a chance to reflect on HIS hand which I do not want him to do. I want him to focus on the amount he CAN call on the river to be good.

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  4. the fact you continued was all that matters. was not unreasonable that he played a suited 9J this way. his thin river call showed he was weak. if you folded then we could say you misplayed. good hand for HOTD & analysis/ your thinking is valuable. kudos

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  5. Why wouldn't you think he was holding a pair of eights?, on the turn an eights shows up giving him a set which would be stronger than your two pairs. Again I just want to know why you didn't think he was holding a pair?

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  6. Alec Torelli is a cheater

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  7. OK Alec, it makes sense… but what about the 96 suited??

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  8. top top nightmare

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  9. hey alec thanks for this video, I have a question: what if he shove on the river after you check. Are you gonna call for additional 13k? or nah? thank you.

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  10. heres the problem i see with alecs vids. Alec barfs out alot of words and theories an what ifs. He is super intelligent ofcourse. But u have to develop your own style and intuition. Trust me. I play 2-5 every other day. If i employed torellis strategies to my game i would get busted. His shit works for him. But i doubt it will work for most folks who watch this stuff. Listen… money management and patience and strong fundamentals built my bankroll into something im actually saying wow to myself about. I moved up to 2-5 and because my basics are 2nd nature, Now Ive been studying certain things like facial expressions and chip and hand patterns when someone might be starting a downswing. I can almost gaurantee most of u cant employ alecs methodology into your own game.

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  11. Alex the mistake was on the flop not the turn…always enjoy ur vids,KEEPUM COMIN !

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  12. I like your videos Alec, but 15 minutes to explain one hand, come on

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  13. n00b

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  14. Excellent analysis thank you! David's set combos are small given your Q blocker and he likely 3 bets 10s preflop. You wouldn't expect him to call the flop with 88. So sets seem limited to 44. So with hindsight the turn shove seems better. But to my mind these sorts of decisions often come down to your read on the villain. If they're tight and cautious then lean towards the call versus a shove on an aggressive player?

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  15. Aren't you being results oriented? If you just open shoved the river, what if he snapped you with pocket 4s or the straight instead? What if he had KJ of clubs? Checking the river would've been the right play

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  16. Usually when I see a min raise I put them on a monster. I disagree with the commentator.

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  17. At 1/3 I jam every time. River would be A. lol.

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  18. It doesn't matter if your opponent could have bluffs in his range. The only thing that matters is will he continue bluffing on the river. Because if he won't and will only bet when he improves you get owned, especially out of position. Most people aren't bluffing with zero equity, which is the only hand you wouldn't want to shove against, so if you shove he may call as a 3 to 1 dog anyway. Even if you are the best hand reader in the world and can get away from your hand correctly on some river, you still let him realize his equity for the price he decided he wanted to pay instead of punishing him for his unbalanced play.

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  19. Stop n Go would have been GREAT. Slightly risky, but great. That would have left him thinking, "Wtf? This HAS to be a bluff."

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  20. Yeah, after listening to your opinion of the turn re-raise, you were absolutely correct when you said, "If my opponent has set / straight I just have to pay him off." Therefore, you should have jammed because MOST often top-two is good. If you played that scenario out 100 times, he'll have a set/straight probably 10% of the time I imagine.

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  21. Alec, we all get out-played once in a while, and in your case, you still won the f'n pot.

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  22. Alec, curious how often you run into fun players in VegasLA, that you've played with in Macau? It happened to me once or twice and I thought it was quite wild. I enjoy your content, keep it up. We met at One Central one night, you seem like a genuinely nice guy; cheers!

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  23. love that u post hands that u didnt played perfectly or optimaly..keep up the good work alec..

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  24. Alec,

    I had almost the same type of hands where i flopped top pair with second nut flush draw and check shoved all in during a live game 3x and got paid with it 🙂 That's my favorite time to make it look like a pot steal!

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  25. Hes just pot controlling with that weird raise he should have jammed tho as a bluff, because when you only call he knows you at best have two pair hands or one pair with gut shots and flush draws.

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  26. What would you do if he raised 3x on the turn?

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  27. That guy David is a MASSIVE fish. He plays awful, I watched that entire game where he played and lost his entire stack….and just kept losing after he re-bought back in. I can't even believe he sat in a game like that. He needs to play at the 1 penny/2 penny games.

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  28. i think that chess helps you a lot in poker or not???

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  29. @Alec Torelli Firstly, I don't understand why you think he has T8 in his range with that $1k flop call in a MW pot. It's just not happening. His range is precisely sets/TP/straight draws here. The turn is a bad card for you, since now you only beat TP and KJ, both of which are almost never raising that sizing OTT. Therefore, I'm pretty concerned when he raises that turn, since you mostly beat nothing if you exclude Q8s from his preflop calling range. Ofcourse, it would help to know he makes information minraises of these kind with TPTK to see a cheap river, but without that read, this is a pretty tough spot since majority of the player pool is just never raising AQ there. Shoving over his raise looks so strong and seems pretty bad since you're only getting called by better and even AQ is going to fold vs your shove if he was raising for information. As weird as it may sound, I think this is more of a fold without the club flush redraw OTT. I'm interested to know what was your plan if he shoved the river.

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  30. I have an alternative line: re-raise turn to 10,000-11,000$.
    This way you won't lose value if a 9, J or K (25% probability) comes on the river.

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  31. vs a rec this is a clear turn 3bet (or big river donk) but vs a reg/thinking player it's totally fine to call turn coz of the range he represents. good analysis alec

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  32. Yes unconventional raise on the turn by villain. But I don't get you should have shoved. If villain had you beat (set or straight) he would have called. I don't think a AQ would call a shove there.

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  33. had he had 44, would you still look back at your turn decision this way? honest question

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  34. Yes, reraise on Turn, doesn't have to be all-in, but definitely build the pot. I know you wanted to balance your range but perhaps save that for either when you are in position OR when you have two pair with no Flush draw? It's rare to be covered either way on River (whether River is a Club or not) and I feel that might mean to fatten the pot on Turn.

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  35. You always want to get to showdown with two par and you did. Good Job.

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  36. It's hard to say you got outplayed because you won the pot, but David put a move on you that slowed down the action and got him to a cheaper showdown. I don't know what you could have realistically done differently. When he raises the turn, he's telling a story that he's got a hand — could be a straight or a set. It's an easy call for you since you have outs to improve, if he is beating you. But if you come back over the top and he has a straight or a set, he's calling and you would have been way behind.

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  37. I'm here to make fun of you – you aren't good at poker Alec. No sir you are not good …. shameful. ….lolz bro

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  38. Cool tips, especially the points on the turn. No biggie that you didn't max value in this spot cuz the pot was really nice already and I think you did the best you could for not knowing this player and being out of position. 3 things I like about the way you played this hand:

    1) When he raised you on the turn you said you weren't sure how many bluffs he could have in his range, so sometimes it's better to be cautious until one has more information and since hindsight is 20/20. Also, the way he ate his (broccoli?) omelette made him look pretty comfortable with his raise on the turn.
    2) The pot was already a nice size (how big of a pot do you want to play vs an unknown player with only 2 pair?).
    3) When he raises you like that on the turn he's oftentimes saying he's going to bet the river, which gives you a chance to check-call or check-raise the river – thus, maxing value by keeping any bluffs in that he had and getting marginal hands committed.

    I wonder if you had seen him bluff at all during the game? Either way, if I were going to do anything differently myself in this exact spot with my limited information I would have chosen one of the other two alternative lines you mentioned or one of my own:

    1) to jam the turn (and QUICKLY to make it look fishy) or
    2) do the stop & go move – calling turn then jamming river
    3) call the turn, but then tank a bit, maybe do some defensive chip handling, then check to make myself look weak like I missed a draw to induce his river bet
    4) Another thing I do sometimes to induce bluffs/raises when I'm out of position when someone steals the lead from me on one street is to steal it back on the next street by leading out into them with a very small bet, especially against aggressive players. Their dislike of getting the lead stolen away from them compounded with the strangely small bet size makes them often feel the need to play back.

    Thanks again for sharing the info and don't be upset cuz it was still a sweet spot.

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